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| GeoCommunity Mailing List |
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| Subject: | RE: [gislist] GIS Data for China and Nicaragua |
| Date: |
09/12/2003 04:15:01 PM |
| From: |
Gregory Yetman |
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Hi Dimitri,
Thanks for the compliment. As for the fundamental GIS layers in our China
Dimensions data, they are based on V-Map level 0 (created back when
seamless extracts were not common on the net). The administrative boundary
and census data, as far as I know, are unique but unfortunately dated and
small-scale.
I have yet to come across a more detailed national data set for China that
is comporable to DCW or VMap0 (other than VMap1, of course). I will check
around with some colleagues to see if they have heard of anything new and
post to the list(s) if I find anything.
Greg
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Gregory Yetman
Center for International Earth Science Information Network (CIESIN)
Columbia University
URL: http://www.ciesin.columbia.edu/
e-mail: gyetman@ciesin.columbia.edu
tel: (845) 365-8982
----------------------------------------------------------------------
On Fri, 12 Sep 2003, Dimitri Rotow wrote:
>
> > Have you tried CIESIN's China Data Holdings?
> >
> > http://sedac.ciesin.columbia.edu/data.html
> >
>
> Very good suggestion (God bless CIESIN for the public service they provide),
> but unfortunately that data set is only 1:1-million-scale, about the same as
> VMAP0, etc.
>
> The real solution for Layne is to get the VMAP1 collection for China out of
> NIMA. VMAP1 is a beautiful 1:250K-scale data set that is perfect for most
> international uses.
>
> VMAP1 is a public domain data set that NIMA is illegally keeping out of the
> hands of the public. Part of it has been released, but those parts that
> tread on the toes of NIMA's cartographic monopolist friends overseas have
> been withheld. Of course, those are the most useful and interesting parts.
>
> By the way, that latter bit is not a rant. I've been told by two NIMA
> staffers that the agency deliberately decided to withhold parts of VMAP1 to
> avoid hurting the business of the Ordnance Survey and other overseas friends
> of NIMA. I was told by those NIMA staffers that they know what they are
> doing is illegal but that they think they can get away with it because NIMA
> has more resources to wait out anyone who doesn't like it. Sad, but true.
>
> To see what is publicly available, use the http://geoengine.nima.mil site to
> see coverages for VMAP1. As you can see, China has not been released even
> though they've had that data for years.
>
> Next, visit the drawing of coverages at
> http://www.manifold.net/images/vmap_avail.png (a big image, about 450KB).
> This is crude and was obtained from an image provided by a friendly NIMA
> staffer and is slightly out of date as regards what has been released, but
> it gives the all-important CD numbers for which CD covers which area. Use
> these CD numbers to file a Freedom of Information Act (FOIA) request with
> NIMA for the CDs. NIMA has a lot of bureaucratic expertise in denying FOIA
> requests, but just keep plugging. Sooner or later as enough people file
> FOIA requests to which NIMA responds illegally, there will be enough
> evidence assembled to hang them.
>
> For practical tips on making FOIA requests, see
> http://www.epic.org/open_gov/
>
> See also the notes at the end of
> http://exchange.manifold.net/manifold/manuals/5_userman/mfd50Public_Access_t
> o_Public_Data.htm for notes on interactions with NIMA. NIMA will try to get
> you to drop your claim. Follow through, don't get snowed and get everything
> in writing. T
>
> What they are trying to do as a recent maneuver is to deliberately "seed" US
> data with what they think can get them an exemption from FOIA (very hard to
> do). But, they are being clumsy about it and are leaving a trail. For
> starters, they can't "seed" public domain data in an attempt to keep it from
> the public and second, this is exactly the sort of bad-faith behavior that
> gets judges really torqued off when one fine day NIMA discovers that the law
> applies to it as well.
>
> I realize that most people don't want to file FOIA requests to get GIS data,
> but who knows... you might get lucky and get exactly what you want for very
> cool Chinese data. If you have any influence with your local Congressional
> representative or Senator you might also be able to get your data that way.
> Just keep at it and remember that the law says you have a right to VMAP1.
>
> Cheers,
>
> Dimitri
>
>
>
> > hey List:
> >
> > Does anyone know where I can get large scale data for these two countries.
> > I have looked at the ESRI Data disks, Geo Community and the Geography
> > Network and can find small scale stuff.
> >
> > I'm also int
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