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| GeoCommunity Mailing List |
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| Subject: | RE: [gislist] Re: certification (?) |
| Date: |
10/22/2003 04:20:01 PM |
| From: |
Richard Serby |
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Just one point from a 'headhunters' perspective. If you take the time and
spend the money and energy to become more proficient in your profession you
are become more valuable to us, as recruiters. "...a way for employers to
get you to do training on your time and not theirs..." is an excuse not to
continue learning as a life-long component of your career. If you are not a
life-long learner ... you will not be a life-long earner. Certification
programs, like earning a college degree, tells me the extent of commitment
that you have to your profession and to your industry.
My 2 cents,
Richard Serby, CEO
GeoSearch, Inc.
-----Original Message-----
From: gislist-bounces@lists.geocomm.com
[mailto:gislist-bounces@lists.geocomm.com]On Behalf Of Mike
Sent: Wednesday, October 22, 2003 3:03 PM
To: gislist@lists.geocomm.com
Subject: RE: [gislist] Re: certification (?)
Maybe we are doing lots of wishful thinking. We can sell lots of advantages
for certification but it could also be seen by employers as a way for
someone to demand more money - something employers may not want to do if
they can get uncertified people of equal quality. The other danger is that
certifications become so common they become not something special, but
simply required and ordinary.
It appears that certifications are only valuable to the certificate holder
if they are rare and difficult to get, otherwise they are simply a way for
employers to get you to do training on your time and not theirs.
Mike
-----Original Message-----
From: gislist-bounces@lists.geocomm.com
[mailto:gislist-bounces@lists.geocomm.com] On Behalf Of Anthony Quartararo
Sent: Wednesday, October 22, 2003 1:55 PM
To: gislist@lists.thinkburst.com
Subject: RE: [gislist] Re: certification (?)
-----Original Message-----
>simply requiring something (eg.
> GIM, ISO 9000, PMP, etc.) by no means guarantees the desired
(required?) results.
The difference here being that the client has an additional means of
receiving what they contract for. A GIM is bound by professional ethics and
therefore can (and should be) subject to complaint or discipline. The
offending company/person could find themselves without a license and
therefore with no way to remain in the industry.
AQ: Yes, perhaps, but that misses my point. Aside from the administration
that will be required to police these "complaints" that still does not
provide assurance that a GIM will actually PERFORM well as a Manager. Are
you suggesting that a Client that "requires" by contract that a GIM be in
charge, can then file potentially career-halting complaints at-will ? I
mean, what are the metrics by which a Client can gauge a GIM's performance ?
Who qualifies the Client to make that assessment ? Are all these to be
spelled out in 10 m high letters in the sky so everyone is clear before
signing the contract ? What responsibilities and ethical obligations doe
CLIENTS have in this temporal union ? A GIM could execute his/her duties
perfectly, but have a nightmare of a client who changes the specification
constantly, and blames it all on the GIM (of course this NEVER happens....)
Does the GIM have a mechanism to redress and challenge these "complaints" ?
At some point, there will be just too many hoops and too much administrative
and intellectual overhead for many GIS people to consider, and they may lack
the interest to become convenient punching bag for an incompetent Client
organization....
> someone who is not certified could be 10X better than 100 certified
people
Possible, yes, but would you get your appendix removed by someone who
claimed to be just as good as a doctor? Would you allow a non-regulated
paralegal to handle a court case that could put you in jail if you loose? We
are trying to elevate GIS to a Profession (capital P!). The non-certified
expert, in this case, would still be free to be part of a project team that
includes GIMs, therefore the client does _not_ loose.
AQ: Since when did the GIS profession need to have a certification to become
a Profession ? What do you call the hundreds of thousands of professionals
around the world ? Hobbyists? Enthusiasts ? Practioners ? O.L.S. O.L.I.P.
wanna-bees ? Come on now, you are actually promoting the idea of REGULATING
the GIS profession and professionals ? I can hear the slow soft suffocating
influences of that paradigm on the profession already if that is the future.
Perhaps I am reading this wrong, but you say "we" are trying to elevate
GIS...as if those of us who are not certified and have no intentions of
seeking certification are somehow responsible for and desire to keep the
profession in some un-elevated status.
I am not be facetious, but promoting certifications as a worthwhile endeavor
that will bolster the integrity of the professionals, and by extension, the
profession is one thing, mandating by contract is quite a
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