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| GeoCommunity Mailing List |
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| Mailing List Archives |
| Subject: | Re: [gislist] Support for non-certified instructors to teach GIS
classes |
| Date: |
02/14/2007 01:55:00 PM |
| From: |
Scott Madsen |
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Listers,
In response to my post, a fellow lister made the offer to provide training
to our county for a reduced rate of $400 per student. That was very kind of
him to offer - and I do mean that earnestly.
However, $400/student X 20 students = $8000. I figure I can provide the
training for the cost of training materials only: $70/student X 20 students
= $1400. That's $6,600 to pay someone for the cost of instructing a 3-day,
20-hour course. That's $330/hour.
Am I making it any clearer why I want to teach this course myself?
I'm not arguing one way or another about whether or not that kind of rate is
justified. Maybe it is. I'm only making the point that most local
governments and small businesses can't afford it, even if it is offered to
them at a reduced rate. (By the way, in case anyone else is doing the math:
at the 'normal' $800/student fee rate, that's $660/hour for the labor of
instructing the course).
I wonder how many taxpayers would agree with me that, if I'm able to teach
the course myself, I had darn well better do so...
(By the way, I'm asking my commission for a raise and I'm getting certified
to be an ESRI instructor)!!!
Scott
-----Original Message-----
From: DeWayne Colombe [mailto:dcolombe@ncdcimaging.com]
Sent: Wednesday, February 14, 2007 12:46 PM
To: 'Scott Madsen'
Subject: RE: [gislist] Support for non-certified instructors to teach GIS
classes
Scott,
I'm not sure what you consider low cost but my boss who is an authorized
instructor volunteered his services for $400 per student, we normally charge
$800. I grew up in Madison, SD and thought maybe we could help. Let us
know if you're interested.
DeWayne Colombe
Production Manager
NCDC Imaging & Mapping
Colorado Springs, CO 80906
719.579.9276
www.ncdcimaging.com
-----Original Message-----
From: gislist-bounces@lists.thinkburst.com
[mailto:gislist-bounces@lists.thinkburst.com] On Behalf Of Scott Madsen
Sent: Wednesday, February 14, 2007 11:13 AM
To: gislist@lists.thinkburst.com
Subject: [gislist] Support for non-certified instructors to teach GIS
classes
Listers,
I'm disappointed with ESRI's response (or lack thereof) to my request for
help in putting together a low-cost GIS training class for my county. I'm
curious to find out if any other GIS Coordinators or the like have
experienced similar frustration in this area. (Please excuse the length of
this post but I wan to make sure I explain the situation properly).
The class I'm trying to put together will cover Beginner ArcGIS 9.2
instruction for at least 12, maybe as many as 20 county government folks
including commissioners, department heads and staff. We have a lot of
interest in GIS at our county, however, employee training budgets are
stretched far enough the way it is so we just can't afford to bring in a
certified instructor or send these folks to a certified class when, as the
GIS Coordinator, I am perfectly capable of teaching the class myself.
I've attended certified ESRI training courses and have found them to be well
structured using well-organized training resources (workbooks, Power Points,
etc). So, I'd like to teach a similar class using the same or similar
teaching resources: yet, without the cost of a certified instructor. For a
class of 20 people, this would save us thousands of dollars so, it's a
no-brainer.
I realize that, in a utopian society, all GIS users would be able to afford
an ESRI sponsored instructional course. However, small businesses and local
government folks don't usually work within such an environment - typically,
we have to find less expensive ways to do things. Invariably, it
disappoints me when I talk to current and potential GIS users who make the
comment that they'd like to attend a certified ESRI training course but
can't afford to do so. When I suggest that they use ESRI's online courses,
attend GIS user conferences or become members of GIS user groups in order to
get more training, many of these folks respond that they don't like online
training and that the costs associated with travel to conferences or
meetings is often cost and/or time prohibitive.
The only real alternative for many local government and private sector
businesses is to have a class taught locally with minimal costs associated
with it. This means taught by a county GIS Coordinator like myself in a
local county meeting room with only the cost of instructional materials to
consider. I've already done a fair amount of research on instructional
materials and have found a couple of ESRI workbooks including temporary
software licenses that look like they would work for this purpose (GIS
Tutorial and Getting to Know ArcGIS Desktop).
However, my frustration with ESRI is that they refuse to release their
instructor resource materials to a non-certified or non-u
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